This week, we’re sitting down with Muneer Panjwani, CEO of Engage for Good, to explore how neurodiversity fits into the evolving world of corporate social impact (CSI). As the leader of one of the most influential CSI platforms, Muneer shares insights on the shifting diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) landscape and what it means for leaders who remain focused on this work. Plus, you’ll hear how Muneer is using programs like the Halo Awards to elevate underrepresented cause areas — including disability and neurodivergence — into broader corporate social impact conversations.
This week, we’re sitting down with Muneer Panjwani, CEO of Engage for Good, to explore how neurodiversity fits into the evolving world of corporate social impact (CSI). As the leader of one of the most influential CSI platforms, Muneer shares insights on the shifting diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) landscape and what it means for leaders who remain focused on this work.
Plus, you’ll hear how Muneer is using programs like the Halo Awards to elevate underrepresented cause areas — including disability and neurodivergence — into broader corporate social impact conversations.
Timestamps
(04:41) How leaders are shifting their DEI mindset
(14:57) Why imperfect efforts can still drive inclusion
(17:39) Rethinking corporate values for today’s world
(19:00) Why nonprofit business partnerships will lead the way
(22:05) What’s next for corporate social impact
We love hearing from our listeners! Email us at podcast@understood.org
(00:00) Introduction
Nathan Friedman: Welcome to "Minds at Work," the podcast for leaders who embrace neurodiversity in business. I'm your host, Nathan Friedman, co-president and chief marketing officer of Understood.org, the leading nonprofit focused on helping those who learn and think differently thrive.
Each week, we're here exploring how neurodiversity sparks innovation and how we as leaders across various industries can create a more inclusive future for all. Today, I'm excited to be talking with Muneer Punjwani, CEO of Engage for Good. If you don't know them already, Engage for Good is all about helping companies and nonprofits come together to create real, lasting social impact.
In this conversation, we'll talk about how neurodiversity fits into the broader social impact landscape and why authentic engagement with neurodivergent individuals isn't just good ethics, it's good business. Muneer, welcome to the show.
Muneer Punjwani: Thanks, Nathan. I'm very happy to be here.
Nathan Friedman: So great to be talking with you live. And, you know, we've met before and had some great conversations about what you've done at Engage for Good over the past few years. Tell us about what brought you to Engage for Good.
Muneer Punjwani: So my journey to Engage for Good is pretty special. Years ago, this was back in 2012, I was brand new to the world of corporate philanthropy and corporate partnerships. I'd just been offered a job as a corporate partnerships manager, even though I had zero experience in the field. And I was looking for answers. I was looking for expertise. So Engage for Good, at the time was known as Cause Marketing Forum, was the first conference I went to.
That was my crash course in how companies and nonprofits work together, what effective partnerships look like, and what it takes to build real impact. And I kept going back year after year because it was the place to learn, to get inspired, and meet leaders who were shaping the work.
So now, getting to lead this organization and lead this work and create this space for other people is just a beautiful full-circle moment for me to help future leaders, you know, learn how to create impactful partnerships that not only drive business value, but also social impact.
Nathan Friedman: And I think, you know, thinking of that connection between social impact and business outcomes, a lot of people can remember the day when this was, you know, CSR, cause marketing, or charity, local engagement. And it evolved to ESG. You know, this is an evolution of how people think about the industry. You know, you have a really unique purview on how brands and nonprofits are working together to create these inclusive and equitable futures.
What are you seeing now and hearing from these corporate and nonprofit leaders who have been not only engaged in DEI, but are grappling with this current anti-DEI movement?
Muneer Punjwani: Well, I think we have to kind of zoom out a little bit and think about how the culture changes over time, right? Businesses responded to how culture was changing because people started to say that we care about companies that care about the planet and about the people that it's serving and the communities that they're in, right?
So it wasn't out of nowhere that this came out. It came out of direct data points that pointed to the fact that there was higher consumer loyalty, better employee engagement and retention. There were better business outcomes if companies focused on activities that were good for the world, ultimately.
And that fueled the fire of leading innovations across the sector that allowed companies to look at their businesses not just as an entity that was providing some kind of business value or product value or benefit to society in a way that just felt very transactional, to then looking at saying, how do we make this better for the people that we're serving in a in in a variety of ways.
Muneer Punjwani: So now we look at the culture and the culture's changed a little bit more, right? We've had about two decades, I would say, of progress in CSR, ESG. We've normalized a lot of languages and a lot of frameworks for how this work can be beneficial for multiple stakeholders. And now we are seeing a bit of a backlash in culture as well.
People are starting to see that while there's a massive population that still cares about doing good for the world and expects business to do so, there's also a big chunk of the population that doesn't understand it. And that's how I see it.
I think we haven't done a good job of communicating the social value and impact of businesses doing good. I think we have entered too much into the political landscape of why these issues should matter to companies.
So, because it's been politicized, now companies are starting to retract because the data points that they're getting from their consumers is also that, hey, maybe you're getting too woke or you're getting too political, which I think is bad for business overall in the long term. And I think what's happening now is very much a short-term reset for our industry.
Nathan Friedman: Yeah, it's interesting. I've been at a few industry events, and by industry, I mean more marketing and more general industry events around business. And there is still a lot of support for diversity, equity, and inclusion activities. But there is this notion of fairness that's related to DEI, and people think that DEI gives people an unfair advantage in certain instances. And that's not necessarily the case.
And I think there's an interesting tenet throughout our culture right now of what is fair, what is not fair. And that polarization we're seeing in a lot of different areas. You know, when you talk to leaders, I'm assuming, and I don't — I shouldn't assume — but are you hearing significant commitments to these initiatives, whether or not they're publicly for them?
Muneer Punjwani: The way I've been looking at it is, you know, I talk about, I talk about three kinds of courage that I'm seeing right now, right? There's the loud courage, there's quiet courage, and then there's collective courage, right? Loud courage is something we've seen for quite a while now with companies taking a very strong stance for a social issue. You know, that's through massive investments in nonprofits, big internal initiatives for employees, policy changes to big press releases and PSAs. That's all loud courage to show what a company cares about and how they're practicing their values, right?
Then there's the quiet courage. This is the stuff that happens behind the scenes, right? This is the stuff that you don't get to talk about as much. So policy changes that are not getting press releases. CEOs that are maybe changing the name of the team, but making sure the team is still fully funded to do the work of fairness and equity in the workplace, right?
And the third thing that we're starting to see a lot more of now is collective courage, which is more organizations coming together to say, these are the challenges for our cause area. And here are the solutions that we're working on together, right?
I think one thing that I'm really excited about in the future of our work that I'm starting to see a lot more of is a lot of organizations and even companies are investing in nonprofits are starting to sort of ask themselves the questions, what are we really good at and how can we really focus in on that?
So when you think about collective courage, that's really collective action. So competitors who saw each other as competitors are now seeing each other as collaborators to say, if we're going to focus on disability or neurodivergence or hunger or homelessness, right, what is one or two areas that we can really specifically focus on because we're really good at it? And how do we find partners, whether that's corporate partners, foundation partners, or other stakeholders, who can help us be even better at that one thing?
And that way, we can have multiple stakeholders and multiple collaborators who can focus on an area that feels much more deeply impactful rather than broadly impactful.
Nathan Friedman: And I think solidarity is different than advocacy, which is different than performative actions that are because somebody else is doing it, and you feel pressure to do so. And a lot of it is linked intrinsically to what a brand is, and intrinsically linked to what a brand can authentically stand behind, right?
But it opens the door to really the essence of what I think a lot of individuals feel DEI has value is the imperatives that it's right for the business, it's right for employees, and it's right for others in stakeholders and the U.S. consumers at large.
Nathan Friedman: And I think we see a lot of that with neurodivergence, right? And I think, you know, engagement of neurodivergent employees, we see constructively solving more complex problems. We see more higher retention rates, we see higher elements of creativity and solving complex problems leads to new market opportunities. How have you been hearing about neurodiversity in your world? And how does this, or does it fit into your work and life?
Muneer Punjwani: So it absolutely fits into my work and life, right? It's a, I think it's everywhere. And it's everybody in some way is connected to this issue, whether personally or people that they know. You know, I was born in India and this was, you know, back in the '80s, so aging myself here. And I remember looking back on it now, I remember quite a few of my cousins were probably neurodivergent in the way that they behaved and the way that they struggled with just normal, day-to-day activities.
And I also remember their parents having a really hard time with it. And I remember that they were punished a lot more, you know, than other cousins were, than I was. You know, I was a rebellious kid, so I was punished in different ways. But...
Nathan Friedman: Well, I was about to say, were you the good kid?
Muneer Punjwani: I was definitely not a good kid. No, no.
Nathan Friedman: A pleasure to have in class?
Muneer Punjwani: I was definitely not a pleasure to have in class. But, you know, looking back on these scenarios as an adult and knowing so much more about neurodivergence now, I think about how different their lives would have been — and I say they as in my cousins and their parents — would have been if they had just awareness that this wasn't something that, you know, was attached to some superstition, right? This wasn't something that was a problem to take care of, right? This was an asset. And there are ways to deal with it. So...
And I think there are a lot of cultures out there who have similar experiences with mental health, with disability, where there's just a lot of stigma and taboo connected to it. So I see my role as, you know, as leading Engage for Good, in raising awareness about a lot of cause areas that typically don't get a lot of attention. So when I came on as CEO a couple of years ago, one of the things I wanted to do was introduce the disability category in the Halo Awards. Halo Awards are the most coveted social impact awards in the country. And you guys just won one. Congratulations.
Nathan Friedman: Thank you.
Muneer Punjwani: And I realized that out of the 14 categories, we didn't have a category for best disability campaign, right? Which, you know, I know neurodivergence is different than disability. There's some overlap there, but it's a bit different. But it kind of goes to show...
Nathan Friedman: It's covered as part of the ADA and, you know, the broader umbrella.
Muneer Punjwani: Yeah. So, my thought was, why aren't we covering this? I know so many people in my life who are disabled, and they see it as such an asset, and they are working on a variety of awareness or impactful campaigns and initiatives and organizations that are doing really good work to support this community. Like, we should celebrate this a little bit more.
And I also see awards as a way to raise the profile of a cause area and then incentivize other stakeholders in the field to then want to invest in it because they want to win those awards. So I'm using Engage for Good as a platform to raise the awareness of this really broad topic, right? That affects so many people that is also not as politicized in today's climate as, you know, some of the other issues are. So I would say it's a very safe, safer issue for brands to probably invest in and focus on right now.
Nathan Friedman: For the listeners who may not know, Understood.org was honored to receive a Halo Award for our work with 11:11 Media and Paris Hilton, which raised awareness about the underdiagnosis and misunderstandings of ADHD, particularly around women. Can you tell us just a little bit about that work and what stood out to you?
Muneer Punjwani: Yeah. Well, first of all, huge fan of Paris Hilton. So that was already a standout. You know, I remember, you know, when I was in high school, you know, you read the tabloids and you see her dancing on bars, right? And it was a very different Paris Hilton back then. And then I think, you know, she really started to focus on areas of her life that were really private and made them public.
And she did it in a way that felt really meaningful because it wasn't just about her telling her story, but her telling her story so that other people could relate to it. And I think having somebody like Paris be so vulnerable about her ADHD, about the institutional child abuse that she suffered is really powerful for the culture, especially for young women. So one, I loved that Paris was part of it.
Two, I loved how little I knew, and I think how little a lot of the judges who were judging the campaigns knew, about women's experience with ADHD. So reading about all of that, I've learned a lot, and I think it was really important to focus on a population and intersect it with an issue that we're all aware of, right? But I'd never seen a campaign on ADHD specifically about women.
And the way that you communicated that message, right, through the website, through the songs and through Paris's social media, you know, there's a lot of entertainment and fun value to it, but there's also a lot of depth to it as well.
Nathan Friedman: Well, number one, thank you to the judges, um, and the recognition. I think what it stands for though is raising awareness of something that people may not quite understand. The fact that boys are diagnosed three times the rate as girls, the fact that there's multiple types of ADHD, it manifests very differently, with girls, it's more internalized. Um, and you know, the mere fact that ADHD and autism and other conditions were primarily thought of as men's or boys' issues, not girls', has changed dramatically over the past few years.
There's not a lot of research. 99.5% of research is done on men. That means 0.5% of research is done on women who learn and think differently. That is crazy.
Muneer Punjwani: That's wild. But it's also such a great opportunity for foundations and brands to take a leadership role in, right? Because they can really separate themselves from the pack when they're trying to align their values with a social cause that is very common amongst a population that also has a lot of spending power.
Nathan Friedman: And I think, going back to Paris, she's had a tremendous impact, you know, around ADHD. She views it as a superpower. And that drives her entrepreneurship. And she, as the original influencer, how does she leverage that for the good of others?
And that is something I think we can all look to where we're in an environment where trust in the institutions or trust in what traditionally we would, you know, look to for leadership may or may not be there depending on where you sit. How do we look to other people who are authentically engaging and driving change? And she's one of the people that can do that.
Muneer Punjwani: I totally agree. And I think what when you said trust, what it reminded me of is how when you look at what Gen Z wants, you know, from brands, is more of that vulnerability and that honesty. And I wish there were more brands that were entering the neurodivergent space or disability space and being messy with it, right? And just trying new things and saying that, hey, we care about this community.
We see the innovation, you know, that could come from this community. We value the employees who may be neurodivergent, right? And we see the unique skills that they bring to the table for us.
And not only that, the products and services that we're developing could reach such a broader audience if we were, you know, building it with neurodivergent people. But I think a lot of brands are sort of holding back potentially because they don't know the right way to do it.
Nathan Friedman: And is that, do you think that's the core reason? Um, they just don't know the way to do it, or there's other priorities? I see people not necessarily knowing how to engage in a lot of things right now. And as you point out, like, can you just get in and start? You don't have to be perfect. You got to start somewhere.
Muneer Punjwani: Absolutely. And I think that there's two sides to this. One is we need to see more companies be more courageous and brave in addressing issues that they haven't before, right? And I think there's a possibility now because of some of that pullback, it creates space for other issues to take center stage. And neurodivergence, as we talked about earlier, is not politicized, you know, it affects so many people. So there is a lot of potential for companies to enter, quote, unquote, the market and figure out a way to communicate this to their consumers and their employees and other stakeholders.
But the other side of it also is that culture and people who are culture carriers need to be receptive to that, right? How receptive are we to companies making a mistake? And I think one of the downsides of the last five to, you know, seven years, I would say, in the sort of pro-social justice culture has been that the cancel culture, like calling people out. And I think calling people out disincentivizes a lot of people from taking risks.
And if we're going to call people out, we need to call them in. So I always say, you know, it's OK to say where things went wrong or where somebody could have done better. But then you have to invite them back into the conversation and say, here are different ways to do it. Right? It doesn't help to push them away and then basically jail them out of the conversation. That's not going to help us move our movement forward. So, I think that culture change is slowly happening.
So I'm really excited to hear that there's a lot more conversations happening about neurodivergence. And I think companies will probably start to hop on that bandwagon because they're seeing more companies do it, right? That that's usually how it happens is that nobody wants to be the first. And if they're the first, they get, you know, a lot of a lot of flack for it.
But when they see a lot of companies talk about it, when it gets on stages like Engage for Good or Cannes, then they start to get the confidence and say, oh, this is now a comfortable topic for us to focus on.
Nathan Friedman: Well, it's FOMO. They have the fear of missing out on something. What would also love to hear your perspective. Are you seeing anything change in your work and your fields around what people are focusing on?
Muneer Punjwani: Yeah, so there's a lot of hesitation around where our sector is going to go. When I say our sector as in corporate social impact sector, there's some fear around it. And there is a lack of leadership in terms of what needs to happen for us to continue to do our work, but do it in a way that feels more strategic and more impactful.
I think what happens when culture changes is that, you know, you get everybody on board. And when you get everybody on board, everybody wants to do everything. And now this reset is asking a lot of stakeholders, what do you want to do that is uniquely important to your story, your customers, your value systems? So we're seeing it now from brands is they're asking that question much more strategically.
And I think that's why some of them are going much more quieter because they're like, wait, we actually don't know who we are. We don't know how to evolve our work. We don't know how to focus in from a broadly impactful strategy that focused on LGBTQ rights, racial justice, to mental health, to homelessness and hunger, to now focusing in on maybe one or two cause areas that feel much more relevant to our business areas.
And the other side of that is we're also seeing a lot of innovation around nonprofits working very closely with companies to be a strategic business partner with them, right? And I think that is a fantastic result of this movement that we built over the last 20 years where before nonprofits are only seen as a charity. Give them a, you know, a few thousand dollars, get their logo, put it on a product, and it's done, right?
Now, nonprofits are so big and so influential and also so smart that they have unique expertise about a population. They have access to a unique population. They have brand recognition and brand equity that brands can tap into. And they have massive marketing might, right? They know how to communicate to these customers in a way that feels really authentic and real.
So brands that are doing really good work right now in social impact are moving into much more of the strategic business partnerships with the nonprofits rather than looking at them as just a charity to fund. And that's a very, very strategic shift that I think we'll see more and more of in successful initiatives and partnerships.
Nathan Friedman: And I think — because you hit the nail on the head on that. And I think for nonprofits to thrive in an environment where there is no more federal funding basically for this, how do you get your message out? And I think it's important for nonprofits to not only think of themselves as a business, but to think of themselves more of how do I deliver impact most effectively and efficiently? Are there any companies or organizations that you're thinking of that — or any sectors that are doing this particularly well?
Muneer Punjwani: I think, yeah, in the neurodivergent space, the tech firms are doing a great job, right? I think that's probably a sector that has seen and has been able to measure the positive impact of neurodivergent skill sets on their business.
Nathan Friedman: For coding, for... connecting dots, etc.
Muneer Punjwani: Yeah, for coding, for product design. So many, so many benefits.
So they have invested quite a bit into organizations as well as leaders, as well as internal policies and innovations around how to support and not just support, but also elevate, celebrate, and create inclusive workplaces for these individuals to thrive in. You know, Google, Microsoft, SAP, you know, some of those companies have been doing this for years now and they continue to invest more and more into.
I would love to see, you know, more retail brands, like CPG or, you know, imagine like a, like a, like a big fashion brand doing something on neurodivergence, right? Or um, a grocery chain, you know, like a Stop & Shop or, I mean, Stop & Shop is on the East Coast, that's where I'm from, but, you know, doing a, you know, some sort of awareness campaign or some sort of inclusive initiative that helps neurodivergent people to be part of that ecosystem a little bit better. And I think there's a lot of opportunity there that's open.
Nathan Friedman: So Muneer, I love that you've done so much already at Engage for Good. Where do you see it going from here given everything that's happening?
Muneer Punjwani: There's so much to do. I still see the corporate social impact sector in its infancy. You know, 20, 25 years is not a long time for this industry in terms of how much scale and impact we've already had and how much more impact we could have if we look at corporate purpose as a deeply influential tool to change the world. And that's the way that I see it. So I see my role as one of the lighthouses for all the leaders and organizations and companies that are trying to do the good work.
And I see us helping to platform leaders, organizations, and causes that are doing innovative work, impactful work, not just for the cause area, but also for the business. So the Engage for Good community is going to grow and grow and grow because we have incredible leaders who are really passionate about finding how to evolve this industry to be something that lasts much longer than, you know, than we expect it to, right?
A lot of people sort of have this feeling that the DEI backlash and the ESG backlash is going to kill our industry. And I think I don't think that's true at all. I think it's helping us reset. Like every industry, there's a moment of reset and this is our reset.
So I want Engage for Good to be that place where people come and say, well, what's next? And that's what we tried to do at the conference this year. And that's what we're trying to do with the Halo Awards as well. The point of Halo Awards is to, one, I think social impact leaders need to be celebrated more. We work very, very hard for very little recognition and very little money. Um, and we deserve to, you know, have a moment of celebration and recognition. So I love throwing the Halo Awards gala to recognize those leaders.
The second part of it is, it sets the standard for what is expected and what is new in this field for what's going to last longer, right? What's next for this? So a lot of the categories that we have and the way that we judge, you know, we have about 30-plus judges that are across the corporate social impact ecosystem who help us pick the winners. So these are the people who are doing the work. And the categories that we pick are really, um, you know, what we want to see more of in the future as well.
So we're setting the standard for what inclusion looks like. And that's why when we decided to include the best disability campaign category, we knew that this topic needed to have a platform. But what was surprising, maybe not so surprising, was that we for the last two years since the category has been active, we've received the fewest applications in that category.
Nathan Friedman: Interesting. Why do you think that is? Is it that people don't know, or is it something else?
Muneer Punjwani: I definitely think people don't know. I think we're the only awards program that has this category. And I think there's not enough work happening. I think that's generally what it is. So my hope is that as the category remains for years to come, that more companies will want to win the award and maybe that will be one of the incentives to join in. But also the winners and the finalists even who are doing good work can get the platform to show other companies and nonprofits and leaders how to do this work, right?
A lot of the work that happens within our sector is influenced by other campaigns and other initiatives. And I think the work that can be celebrated through the Halo Awards could inspire some of that influence in other companies to do similar campaigns.
Nathan Friedman: And I think that's great. And I think there's also a lot of innovation that can occur over time. If you're looking ahead, if you would make predictions, do you want to make any predictions for us on what you think is going to happen in the field?
Muneer Punjwani: I think we're going to see a lot more deeper impact from companies, a lot more longer partnerships with nonprofits, a lot more strategic alliances with nonprofits where nonprofits are seen as experts that they bring to the table when they're planning any business initiatives. And I think we're going to see quite a bit of a change in language of how we talk about social impact that uses a lot more language that the business side of the partnership spectrum uses.
Nathan Friedman: And I think that whoever purchases like some types of training or DEI services or things like that, you need that business rationale and case in order to really have an impact. And I hope we continue to see shareholders vote to keep initiatives like DEI within companies. As you see, you know, all of the different airlines vote for that, you know, you see different corporations and retail, etc., coming coming to to to the rescue to ensure that those maintain, um, the the the levels of service and the level of engagement that we've seen in years past.
Muneer Punjwani: Yeah, definitely. I think that's a great signal for how disconnected, I would say, the administration is from what people actually want. Right? And we run a survey on point of sale giving, which assesses some of the biggest, most impactful campaigns at the point of sale at some of the biggest retailers out there, right? And we found that the money that people are giving at the register continues to go up significantly, right?
People are raising tens of millions or hundreds of millions of dollars for causes that they care about, which I see every single penny, I see as a vote, right? As a commitment to a cause that they care about. So, we're not seeing those donations go down. If that, in fact, they're actually going up. So what that tells us is that whatever the administration thinks people want around DEI and what fears they have, it's still a minority of people that want that.
Majority of people when you take the politics away from these conversations, when you talk about do people deserve the right to have a home? Absolutely. Do people deserve to have access to good health care? Absolutely. Do people deserve to live, you know, in a place where they're electricity isn't massively expensive because of climate change? Absolutely, right? When you make those really commonsense statements, um, people are much more likely to support it. So and and people are doing that.
Nathan Friedman: Well, thank you, Muneer, for joining us today. I really appreciate the conversation and all the work you're doing to drive uh, not only inclusion, but good throughout businesses.
Muneer Punjwani: Cool. Thank you, Nathan, for having me. This was a really fun conversation and thank you for all the work that you're doing at Understood.org.
Nathan Friedman: I appreciate it. Thanks for tuning into "Minds at Work." I hope today's conversation inspired you to think differently about what's possible and how we approach our work as business leaders. If you want to know more about our guest today or the work we're doing here at Understood.org, please check out the show notes. For those looking for resources to better advocate for themselves and others, please visit u.org/work.
"Minds at Work" is brought to you by Understood.org. Understood.org is a nonprofit organization dedicated to empowering people with learning and thinking differences like ADHD and dyslexia. To help us continue and expand our work, please donate at understood.org/give.
The show is produced by Julie Subrin and Alison Hoaklander. Mixing is by Justin D. Wright. Samiah Adams is our supervising producer. Briana Berry is our production director, and Neil Drumming is the editorial director. Our executive directors are Laura Key, Scott Cocchiere, and Seth Melnick. And I'm your host, Nathan Friedman. Please join us next time. We'll continue exploring how difference can spark connection and shape a more inclusive and creative future of business.